• Was this page helpful?
Intuit Blog
|
Support
GoPayment
|
Payroll
|
QuickBooks Online
|
QuickBooks
|
Website Services
Intuit
Sign In
Register
QuickBooks General Forum QuickBooks Payroll 3rd Party Apps that work with QuickBooks QuickBooks Accountant Edition QuickBooks Online for Accounting Professionals QuickBooks Enterprise Solutions QuickBooks Point of Sale
ProAdvisor Program & Certification
ProSeries DMS ProSeries Community
Lacerte DMS Lacerte Community
Intuit Tax Online Tax Research for Lacerte and ProSeries Tax Import for Lacerte and ProSeries Intuit Practice Management EasyACCT Intuit Statement Writer
Starting and Managing Your Practice Classifieds Intuit ProConnection Newsletter Intuit Academy Training Your Peers Recommend
  • QuickBooks & Payroll
  • ProAdvisors
  • Lacerte
  • ProSeries
  • Productivity Tools
  • Training & Resources
Leaderboard
Hide Advanced Search
 
All of these words
Any of these words
This exact phrase
None of these words
In this forum
With posts written by
With posts from
to
mm/dd/yy
mm/dd/yy
Show Advanced Search
Home   Help for Accountants   Tax - ProSeries   Tax - ProSeries Community  
hide
05/24/2012 at 04:51PM PDT
Important Announcement! A planned system-wide upgrade will take place over the Memorial Day Weekend in the US (From Thurs, May 24, 2012 at 6 pm PDT thru Tues, May 29, 2012 at 5 am PDT). This includes QuickBooks, QuickBooks Payroll, Point of Sale, & Salesforce.com. This is only for US based products. This does not affect QuickBooks Online customers! During this time, you can shop, but can’t place orders online, activate products or update account info. We apologize for the inconvenience & thank you for patience while we improve our infrastructure to better serve you. International versions are unaffected. For more info, see our community discussion.
1
37
a0_Z-FstSr4izzacwZ5xHE
Subscribe RSS
MariaR
MariaR
Questions asked: 46
Questions answered: 315
Points earned: 870
MariaR
MariaR
Questions asked: 46
Questions answered: 315
Points earned: 870
Contributor
03/07/11 8:20pm PST
Viewed by asker 03/09/11 1:46am PST

New Insurance Agent & Deductions

ProSeries

So I have a new client that used to work W-2 status for a business management firm (as an office manager). Client left that job to pursue something new - Insurance Agent. Client paid for study materials, took classes, and paid license/registration fees.

Now that I know, state licenses and the education/training is NOT deductible since client paid for it BEFORE becoming an agent. The licenses and continuing education could be deductible now that they are in the business....

Client is insistent everything paid for to become an insurance agent is deductible. Any thoughts? Am I missing something here? (P.S. single client filing with standard deduction)

Thanks!

"The biggest obstacle to wealth is fear. People are afraid to think big, but if you think small, you’ll only achieve small things."
- T. Harv Eker
Submit a reply to this question
Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
 Report Abuse
9 Replies
peterhawaii
peterhawaii
Questions asked: 63
Questions answered: 4267
Points earned: 10614
Accountant Community AllStar
Accountant Community AllStar
Advisory council of Accountant community power users.
peterhawaii
peterhawaii
Questions asked: 63
Questions answered: 4267
Points earned: 10614
Accountant Community AllStar
03/07/11 9:02pm PST

  Below is only on employment related education.

In Help / Help Center under employment related education.  Even if the preceding requirements are met , you can not deduct education expenses if the education:

*Is needed to meet the minimal educational requirements to qualify you for your present work or business, OR

*Will lead to qualifying you for a new trade or business.

If the education qualifies you for a new trade or business, you cannot deduct the educational expenses even if you do not intend to enter that trade or business.

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
7
Reply to this Answer
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
taxiowa
taxiowa
Questions asked: 23
Questions answered: 2238
Points earned: 8636
Accountant Community AllStar
Accountant Community AllStar
Advisory council of Accountant community power users.
taxiowa
taxiowa
Questions asked: 23
Questions answered: 2238
Points earned: 8636
Accountant Community AllStar
03/07/11 9:06pm PST
Best Answer - Chosen by the Community

  Of course you are exactly correct Maria.  I agree explaining this to the client is somewhat difficult.  They cannot differentiate between preparation for a new career for themselves into preparation of a business.  Only the 2nd is deductible of course as start up costs.  That is the only way I can explain it to them sometimes is to separate the business from the individual.  Marketing the business is different than educating yourself.  Good Luck.

  Edit:  Peter gave a good article to provide client with.

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
8
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
MariaR
MariaR
Questions asked: 46
Questions answered: 315
Points earned: 870
Contributor
03/07/11 11:09pm PST

thanx taxiowa. yes i agree the differentiating part is difficult for clients.

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
1
Reply to this Answer
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
peterhawaii
peterhawaii
Questions asked: 63
Questions answered: 4267
Points earned: 10614
Accountant Community AllStar
Accountant Community AllStar
Advisory council of Accountant community power users.
peterhawaii
peterhawaii
Questions asked: 63
Questions answered: 4267
Points earned: 10614
Accountant Community AllStar
03/07/11 9:13pm PST

If he paid for the business license in the current year even though before becoming an agent an earning income, I would deduct it in the year he started earning income.  If worse came to worse I would put it in starting up costs and this would allow me to take a large deduction.  I would get it on the tax return and believe that the IRS would allow it, even if (I did not put it in in starting  up costs).

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
6
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
MariaR
MariaR
Questions asked: 46
Questions answered: 315
Points earned: 870
Contributor
03/07/11 11:14pm PST

how did i know there was more info to be clarified with the client... lol...

so looks like they became an agent and started working as an indep contractror, so they received a 1099-misc. so this is his "business" now, as self-employed.

so the "startup costs" suggestion looks like would work out here in this situation.

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
1
Reply to this Answer
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
Skylane
Skylane
Questions asked: 50
Questions answered: 2067
Points earned: 6265
Accountant Community AllStar
Accountant Community AllStar
Advisory council of Accountant community power users.
Skylane
Skylane
Questions asked: 50
Questions answered: 2067
Points earned: 6265
Accountant Community AllStar
03/07/11 9:42pm PST

MariaR - You're absolutely correct.... the only difficulty you seem to have is educating your client. You might want to show him pub 70 chapter 12.   http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p970.pdf ...  there's a chart that is pretty helpful... let him see for himself....

 

I'd rather be flying........
Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
2
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
Skylane
Skylane
Questions asked: 50
Questions answered: 2067
Points earned: 6265
Accountant Community AllStar
03/07/11 9:54pm PST

FWIW, I've always found that showing the IRS publications to 'clients with misinformation or misconceptions about tax rules' is a very effective way to deal with them. I only print the pertinent section but always include the IRS cover of the pub. 

After explaining why they can't take a deduction, I always tell them what they can and will be able to deduct; suggesting record keeping methods so that they are prepared if their 'future' deductions are ever challenged.

I own an insurance agency and newly licensed producers/agents (who have just sat through state licensing requirements, where they also hear about severe penalties, fines, and suspensions) are generally anxious to do things correctly.  

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
5
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
MariaR
MariaR
Questions asked: 46
Questions answered: 315
Points earned: 870
Contributor
03/07/11 11:15pm PST

skylane, that's a good idea - thanks!!!

Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
2
Reply to this Answer
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
taxguy623
taxguy623
Questions asked: 128
Questions answered: 2063
Points earned: 4609
Accountant Community AllStar
Accountant Community AllStar
Advisory council of Accountant community power users.
taxguy623
taxguy623
Questions asked: 128
Questions answered: 2063
Points earned: 4609
Accountant Community AllStar
03/08/11 10:36am PST
Latest post

related post--additional backup

https://community.intuit.com/p...

If I am busy doing nothing--how do I know when I'm done?????????
Type of Abuse
Abusive behavior
 
Inaccurate information
 
Other (add details below)
 
Add Details
Cancel_sm Submit_sm
This helped me! Add 1 point.
5
Reply to this Answer
 Report Abuse
 
 
 
   
 
Submit a reply to this question
 
Subscribe RSS
Tags for this topic
  • proseries
Use commas to add multiple tags
Add tags
Latest Site Activity
Pause Feed
Mt Juliet CPA
1 hr ago
Mt Juliet CPA
replied to
IRA distribution
Mt Juliet CPA
1 hr ago
Mt Juliet CPA
replied to
Tax preparer responsibility
Mt Juliet CPA
1 hr ago
Mt Juliet CPA
replied to
Search option not working
IRMN
2 hrs ago
IRMN
replied to
Printing Form 1065
Robinjb10
2 hrs ago
Robinjb10
posted
Printing Form 1065
Product Resources
QuickBooks Tax Products Payroll ProAdvisor Program Training and Certification Feedback Survey
Resources: Find Local ProAdvisor Tax Almanac Practice Resources
Support: QuickBooks Lacerte ProSeries EasyACCT
Community Home Help with Intuit Products Start & Grow Your Business Help for Accountants Small Business Blog Join us on Facebook Follow us on Twitter Watch us on YouTube Meet us on LinkedIn
About Intuit | Careers | Register Your QuickBooks | QuickBooks Affiliate Program | Privacy | Legal | Contact Us | Our Hosts
© 2012 Intuit, Inc. All rights reserved. Intuit and QuickBooks are registered trademarks of Intuit, Inc.
Terms and conditions, features, support, pricing and service options subject to change without notice.
TRUSTe - Privacy Standards and Principles
Intuit Websites - Create the perfect site
Intuit Small Business
QuickBooks Accounting Software
Small Business Grants
QuickBooks Online Accounting
Intuit Payroll Services
Intuit Credit Card Processing
Intuit Business Directory
Intuit GoPayment
Intuit Small Business Education
Intuit Small Business Blog
Love a Local Business