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05/24/2012 at 04:51PM PDT
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ArchieLeach
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08/16/11 11:16am PDT
Viewed by asker 08/17/11 9:17am PDT

Estate or not?

ProSeries

Mother of my client dies, leaving a small estate equally divided among three daughters. The daughter who's the executrix gets right on it, distributes the assets, and closes the estate so fast that no tax documents (1099s, insurance payouts, etc) are ever issued in the name of the estate. The 1099s are all issued 1/3 to each daughter for the period after Mom's death.  Mom's home is sold for about $100k, which I will use as the stepped-up basis. Proceeds were paid 1/3 to each daughter. In fact, no estate is created, there is no EIN for it.  Questions:

1. Do I even need to file a 1041 for the estate?

2. Do I need to report 1/3 of the home sale on each daughter's 1040, or can I ignore it, since there is no gain?

Morons. I've got MORONS on my team. Nobody is going to rob us going DOWN the mountain. We have got no MONEY going DOWN the mountain. When we HAVE GOT the money, goin' back UP the mountain, THEN you can sweat.
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poolcleaner
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08/16/11 12:14pm PDT

What was the TIN used for the 1099 on the sale of the house?  That should tell you what you need to do with the sale.  I've seen title companies us the SSNs of the 3 heirs which makes it rather easy.

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ArchieLeach
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08/16/11 12:18pm PDT

>>>I've seen title companies us the SSNs of the 3 heirs which makes it rather easy.<<<

Yep, that's how it was done. The estate never got a TIN.

 

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08/16/11 12:24pm PDT

We are both too quick on the draw with our answers!

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08/16/11 12:23pm PDT

Sorry--I tried to answer the question I thought you had asked not the question you really asked!  I wouldn't ignore the 1099's that the daughters will probably receive from the title company.  Reporting the sale on each daughter's return makes it much cleaner.  I make a habit of NEVER ignoring 1099s even when they are a washout.  Nobody likes to hear from those nice people at the IRS even when there is no tax change.

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08/16/11 12:32pm PDT

Thanks!  Good point.  You agree, then, that there is no need to "create" an estate, get a TIN, and file an estate 1041?  I wouldn't have even considered it, but my client is antsy about it.

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08/16/11 1:02pm PDT

What would you put on the 1041?  There is no income reported to the estate so it would be a waste of time, paper, and ink! I have seen numerous estates done this way with no comebacks.  That was a plug for my favorite book of short stories by Frederick Forsythe called "No Comebacks".

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08/16/11 1:09pm PDT

   I don't do too many estate returns so you might want to take this with a grain of salt.  Filing requirements are estates with gross income of $600 or more.  In your case if house was not rented out or interest earned before distribution of assets I would not file any estate return.  There was no income.  But I have also heard in you "Woof" real loud a certain dog from the east coast would chime in with a more authoritative answer.  Dogs are smarter than road runners.  I can start it for you.

   "Woof"  "Woof"

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08/16/11 1:25pm PDT

I'm not as authoritative as that east coast canine, but I certainly wouldn't file any estate returns in this case.

If this answers your question please click, um, ok I forgot what you are supposed to click. If this answered your question, how about just saying thanks and we will call it good.
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08/17/11 6:15am PDT

I have seen many estates open and close with no 1041...because no income was earned as Taxiowa confirmed.

But the house sale should be shown, (1099's or not, because the house was sold in their names)...even if it is to show a break-even. (Because the IRS doesn't know there is no gain until we tell them)

I have filed several 1040's in recent years under exactly the same circumstances...no comebacks.

"Anyone may arrange his affairs so that his taxes shall be as low as possible; he is not bound to choose that rnethod which best pays the treasury..." Judge Learned Hand - U S Court of Appeals
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08/17/11 8:41am PDT
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My ears were ringing, so I figured that I'd take a quick peek at the Community.

I try to avoid obtaining a TIN and filing a 1041 for small and simple estates.  I tell clients to close out bank accounts of the decedent as quickly as possible to avoid a lot of interest being earned after the date of death (with today's interest rates, it's easy to do).

However, here in Taxachusetts the income threshhold is $100.    

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